To connect USBdrive with UIDE?

[Laaca]

I wrote a quostion to author of UIDE (great disk driver and disk cacher) about possibility to use its logic for external drivers.
The answer is quite detailed so I will not cite it here.
Please, look at this thread: http://www.bttr-software.de/forum/board_entry.php?id=7979
Thank you!

[Bret]

Interesting.

I will check into that in the next version of USBDRIVE. Unfortunately, that will still be many months into the future (I'm not sure exactly when).

I realize that this is not a question for you, Laaca, but has he ever thought of making UIDE a TSR instead of a device driver -- that would give him much more flexibility, including the ability to work with programs like USBDRIVE without the other programs needing a custom modification. If UIDE used AMIS, it would also allow a program like USBDRIVE to inject itself "before" UIDE even if it is actually installed later in time, so that USBDRIVE would not even need to use the external call.

[Laaca]

I don't know the main reason why Jack writes UIDE as device driver and not TSR. Maybe because in this way it can be loaded before any other driver.
However Jack also recomends to load it via DEVLOAD utility like a utility, so I don't know.
Don't hesitate to ask Jack on the BTTR forum.

[Bret]

When I get around to working on USBDRIVE again (assuming somebody else doesn't want to take it over), I'll check this out.

[Bret]

I've been doing some e-mail with Jack over the last couple of weeks, and I've got some bad news.

It turns out that Jack's "external interface" is essentially unusable as it stands now, with the potential to cause serious data corruption and loss. Jack does not appear willing to change this, at least for now, so that is not a viable option.

There's also a possibility for Jack to change in the way his interrupt processing is handled, which could completely eliminate the need for the external interface. Jack is not willing to make those changes at this time, either.

So, it looks like the only way you will be able to cache USBDRIVE's data using UIDE is to wait for the next version of USBDRIVE (which will use INT 13h calls internally), load USBDRIVE first, and then load UIDE (with the help of DEVLOAD or a equivalent) afterwards. The main drawback to this approach is that UIDE is not removable. Because UIDE is installed after USBDRIVE and is using some of the same interrupts, that will also make USBDRIVE unremovable, and consequently will make the USB host controller driver (USBUHCIL) unremovable. So, if you can live with everything being "permanent" (needing to edit CONFIG.SYS and reboot in order to "uninstall" everything), there will be a solution (after the next version of USBDRIVE comes out).

[Bret]

Bad news again. Jack has changed UIDE enough over the last couple of weeks that it looks like there is no way to make USBDRIVE compatible with it. Even the possibility of loading USBDRIVE first and UIDE afterwards is no longer viable.

So, it looks like if you want to be able to cache the data from USB disks as provided by USBDRIVE, you'll need to find a solution other than UIDE. I know there have been several different disk caching programs released over the years, the most famous of which is probably Microsoft's SMARTDRV.

One thing you will need to be concerned about, though, is that USBDRIVE by necessity creates REMOVABLE hard drives, which can definitely cause some problems if the caching program doesn't allow for that possibility. I would think that a DOS-level caching utility (like SMARTDRV) would handle removable hard drives OK, or at least better than an BIOS-level caching utility (like UIDE). DOS understands removable hard drives (DOS is supposed to issue "media change" requests to ALL disks at the beginning of each data transfer). I've never really experimented with this regarding caching utilities, though, so I don't know for sure. If you do some experimenting on your own, I would like to know the results.

[Laaca]

Maybe LBAcache from FreeDOS is worth to try.
The last version is on ibiblio - http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/micro/pc-stuff/freedos/files/dos/lbacache/2008/

I am not sure who is the current maintainer, maybe Eric Auer, but certainly some body with more normal psychics than Jack R Ellis.

Anyway, definitely somebody on the devel FreeDOS mailing list can help.

[berger144]

like to have one of this .

[Bret]

No BIOS-level (INT 13h) disk caching program (like UIDE or LBACACHE) will work appropriately with USBDRIVE as it currently stands. However, a DOS-level (INT 21h/25h/26h) disk caching program (like MS SMARTDRV) should work OK (I haven't actually tested this, though). However, no disk-caching program will work REALLY well with USBDRIVE because of some shortcomings in the USB protocols. I have some ideas on how this might be improved in the next version of USBDRIVE, but it's going to be a long time before I get around to updating USBDRIVE. As always, there's an open invitation to anybody who wants to "take over" any of the USB device drivers or support programs, including USBDRIVE, and start updating it themselves if they want to (I would just ask for some coordination so only one version of the program exists). If nobody volunteers, then everybody will just have to wait until I can find the time.

I can explain all of the ugly technical details of the issues between a caching program and USBDRIVE if anybody cares (it will be a long explanation).

[Laaca]

Jack R. Ellis overthought the removing support for user modules from UIDE and realeased new version where interface for user caching is back, improved and good described. Maybe you could look at it?
http://johnson.tmfc.net/dos/driver.html

[Bret]

I saw that Jack did that a few days ago, and am glad he changed his mind and apparently has created a usable interface. When i start working on USBDRIVE again, I will definitely look at adding this as one of the new features.

[comewander]

Has this problem been solved with the USBDrive with UIDE.. I can't find a solution online. Thanks.

[Bret]

Has this problem been solved with the USBDrive with UIDE.

No, this has not been resolved yet, though I consider this a feature, not necessarily a bug or a problem to be solved. UIDE specifically does not cache hard drives that are flagged as removable, and USB disks are always removable, so UIDE will not (presumably ever) natively work with them. That is simply the way Jack designed UIDE.

I'm not sure if LBACACHE will work or not, but an INT 21h-based cache should work OK (MS SMARTDRV or equivalent).